Elder statesman and erstwhile Senator, OLABIYI DUROJAIYE,talks to Assistant Politics Editor, DANIEL KANU, on the 2015 election, involvement of the military in the election, the challenge before the judiciary and why the country is going down by the day among, other national issues.
Looking at the tension generated by the election, do you really have fears?
I have no fear at all. My courage stems from my faith in God; that God loves this country and I am sure he will not allow it to be destroyed by people who are not doing what they ought to do or who are doing what they ought not to do. So that gives me the courage that this election will come and go and by the grace of God, Nigeria will still remain steady and peaceful. In fact, there will be an upturn because once we effect the change we are praying for, things will be better for the country. It is that optimistic view that I have. Not that I am not aware that there are odds and some serious challenges ahead of us. But with courage and steadfastness, we will overcome them.
Where would you say was the juncture at which we started missing the point?
I think it’s since the intervention of the military. If the military had not intervened, probably we would have learned from our mistakes and we would have stabilised. It is the intervention of the military in the first instance that eroded or destroyed the constitution that our founding fathers agreed with the colonial powers – the 1960 Constitution, parliamentary arrangement. It is not that the military didn’t have some reasons, some excuses for intervening. But if you compare the challenges of the 1960, the level of corruption shouted about in those days, with what we have today, you will know that we have degenerated. But the beauty of democracy is that it is self-correcting. So we will have to learn from our mistakes and let the system correct itself.
What exactly do you see as the issues lacking in our contemporary political culture?
The fault is in every one of us. We have left being Africans, aspiring to imitate the Whites and we never got there. The politicians of the First Republic were respected by members of the society. Today, politicians can only buy their respect. The respect is not voluntary. It is two sides. There are two ways to it. The fault lies with the leaders and also with the followers who feel that whoever wants their support or respect must pay for it; and the leaders who feel everybody is worth a price. Both are wrong. Even then, if you trace it further, you get to the family structure. Society appears to be disintegrating. The Africanness in us whereby the juniors respect the seniors, whereby people fear God, whereby people apply conscience among other values are lacking nowadays. It has reached a level that if you want to send your son or daughter half a mile away, unless you really persuade him or her with some money for transportation, the frowning will be so serious. In our days, we obeyed our parents; the women respected their husbands; their husbands were responsible. Today the family unit is crumbling. There is no law and order even from homes. The family is the microcosm, the minimum unit of society. If we want to correct it, we have to start from the beginning. Education has something to do about it – you need to educate the society about the culture of our people.
Would you say your generation has been fair to the nation in terms of constructive advice?
Let me not be a champion for my generation. I can only speak for myself because we don’t speak with one voice anymore. The falcon does not hear the falconer and the centre is no longer holding. So, I can only talk of myself. However, if we want to get things right we have a golden opportunity now to start somewhere. Instead of bemoaning our fate, we have a golden opportunity now in the next four or five weeks to put things right. Let’s have a change in the structure of things in the country. That is the way I see it. If you check some of the interviews I granted in the past five/six years, perhaps more, I have always emphasised on studying the performance of those great countries that are practicing democracy. That is, Great Britain for about three centuries, the United States of America for about two and third centuries, and the largest democracy, India for about 70 years. They have operated largely on two-party structures. This is the first time we are nearing that two-party structure in the country. It is an ingredient for making democracy work. The issues will be clearer especially to the electorate. The manifestoes will be clearer than when we have 50 political parties. People are confused in such instances. Even literate communities will be confused, let alone an illiterate community as to the numerous symbols and what they stand for. Once you have two-party structures as it appears to be emerging now – the APC is a party to be reckoned with, and the PDP you cannot wave them with the back of your hand. They are still there. Let the other parties try to align with whichever is their choice. Now, we’ve seen for 16 years the PDP has been holding sway. My own judgment is that they have failed. Let APC try. Try four years, eight years, if we do not perform there is nothing wrong for people going back to their first love – to PDP. It is then that the democracy is going to be stable. We don’t have to get the military to do it for us.
Some people are saying that the military should be part of the election.
The military are not to do that. What are the police for? The constitution is clear. It is when we have invasion or threat of massive breakdown that we will invoke the state of emergency. It is then you can call the military. I do not support military coming to supervise election. It is not right. If I were in the senate today, I will certainly vote against allowing military. This shows desperation that the government wants to be there at all cost. But my advice to the government is: Don’t ride the back of a tiger. Those who ride on the back of tigers always end up in the stomach of the tiger. It is not safe to invite military to come and help. That is my advice.
Are you worried when you look at the free fall of the naira and the general state of the economy?
Yes I am not happy about that. That worries me a bit because it is our own doing. Although we know that some of these things are not peculiar to Nigeria alone. It is a global event but our approach to governance also worsens the situation. It started in 2008. We wobbled and wobbled and wobbled.
At a time we started stabilizing but now, this little shock has come. It is like evil wind – we make some steps forward and more backward. The world is now, as people say, a small village. Whatever happens in America is reflected here. We are all connected. If there is trouble in Ukraine or upheaval in Syria, once the atmosphere is tainted, it affects other places. So, what is happening in the economy is so fragile that everyone is affected. But let me tell you this. We have the basic gift, endowment of God. God has been so generous to Nigeria. This is a country we should be calling ‘the country that flows with milk and honey’, like Israel claims. We have the right to claim it too, provided we behave ourselves, we curb our excess propensity to out rich others. Starting with the leadership, when you bribe people to do your will, immediately you get the position you want to make back the money. For them, it is an investment. It fuels corruption instead of helping. Look at the indices, a lot of piracy going on our high seas. The estimate is given. It has been published in the Newspapers. I have not got any strong rebuttal that about 400,000 barrels of crude oil or so are being siphoned and the proceeds pocketed. Nigeria must have been extraordinarily strong economically to be able to sustain that level of sabotage for so long. Look at our refineries, they are not working. We pay to extract the oil. We pay to export the crude. We pay to do the refining. We pay to bring it back. Will the price not be high for the consumer? Then without electricity being fixed, it will be difficult for industries to thrive. Among the things disturbing the economy is that, a good number of companies have moved out. Once we have a purposeful government that will plug all those avenues of leakages in the system, which is what I believe a disciplined progressive APC government will do, we will get it right. We need to have a change of government – a government that has seen all the shortcomings of this present one and will try to put them right. Things will be better.
How would you assess the role of the judiciary in the affairs of the country?
At least, there is one word on the defence of the judiciary. The Chief Justice of the Federation said recently….. “Let me use this opportunity to sound a note of warning to all judicial officers. Do not allow any political party or politician to compromise your integrity or your future. We must never again be used as tools to truncate our nation’s democracy. I assure you that any judge found wanting will have himself or herself to blame as the National Judicial Council will definitely not spare the rod in ensuring that the honour, respect and independence of the judiciary is protected.” This is not Biyi Durojaiye talking. This is the Chief Justice of the Federation, the Honourable Justice Mahmud Mohammed. This was published in The Nation of February 4, this year. It gives me solace. If the Chief Justice has seen the fear you are feeling, it means they have taken official note. The man who can put things right has seen it and has given the warning openly. I don’t remember ever seeing such a stern warning from the Bench. So, that is the answer. It gives me hope that things will be better.
There are people that are yet to get their PVCs. Do you have any word for INEC?
Let me say that INEC has tried. Trying to change INEC chairman on the eve of the election is out of it. They have tried. Are you sure INEC was given all the requirements they put to government in the first instance? This people have almost four years to prepare for this election. We only hear that PVCs were not ready. Is it everything they ask for that were given and in time? You may find that somebody is working to make a situation where things will be unsteady, calling a dog a bad name in order to hang it. I am not a solicitor for Professor Attahiru Jega. But I could read between the lines. A responsible person will not allow his name to be soiled because the whole world is watching what we are doing here. Things have improved in the past days. I noticed that. But it is asking for the moon to expect that 100 percent of the people will have the 100 percent of the PVC and 100 percent will go out on the day of election and vote according to conscience. It does not happen anywhere. Look at the statistics in more civilised and sophisticated places. In America for instance, I don’t think they ever get up to 60 percent of registered voters actually coming out to vote. And it is the majority view that will count. There is no time we will have 100 percent coming. Once we have more than 60 percent, we should go on.
