In this interview with Acting News Editor, ISHAYA IBRAHIM, Professor of Virology and former Minister of Petroleum, Tam David-West, says the decision to increase the pump price of petrol by Minister of State for Petroleum, Ibe Kachikwu, contradicted President Muhammadu Buhari’s stance that fuel subsidy does not exist, adding that the President was not consulted on the issue.
A section of Nigeria Labour Congress (NLC) embarked on strike last week to protest the petrol price hike. How would you react to that?
I was a Labour leader as a student both in Nigeria and abroad. If Labour has a good cause, they should go on strike. But they should explore all avenues first. When I was a Labour leader, I had three conditions that I gave to students to go on strike. And they apply to any Labour union. First, you must have a good cause. Second, there must be unanimous or majority of members supporting that view. Third, there must be a target of protest. Any Labour union that satisfies these three conditions should go on strike. In this particular one, they have a good cause.
I am against fuel price increase. There is no subsidy and I am going to make a formal statement in the press later; a big formal statement. I don’t say things that I have no evidence to prove. Does Labour have a good cause, yes it has. Not only because I am opposed to price increase, I am opposed to anything that will make poor people suffer.
Government exists to serve the people and make them comfortable. Any government that fails in that regard is a failure. Edmund Burke said that much. Burke, the great British philosopher, said “government is a contrivance of human wisdom. Government exists to provide for human wants. Any government that fails to do that is a failure”.
I don’t want Buhari’s government to fail. I have a high stake in this government. Some people are saying I have run away. That is nonsense. I have not run away. Nobody can stop me from talking in the interest of the society. Do I depend on anybody? I depend only on God. And before I speak to the press, I always pray to my God to guide me, to say things and take a position that will glorify his name and positively contribute to the system.
The minister of state, by protocol, had no power to announce this major change when the president was out of the country. Why couldn’t they have the respect to wait until his return? This is a major decision that can cause problem for the government. If they had the interest of this government at heart, they should have waited for him to return. He was away in London. In fact, I had to phone two or more people, and they said they also saw it on the internet.
Don’t you think the president must have given them the nod to announce the increment?
I don’t think he was aware. I have very strong belief that Buhari did not know, because if he knew, he would not have given them the nod because what they are doing is contrary to what he has said over the years.
But why couldn’t they have the respect to wait for him? What if Labour had given you only 24 hours and the president was abroad, and by the time he came back things were disrupted?
I will tell you why Labour has justifiable cause. First, if there must be an increment, it will be for a justifiable reason. I don’t see the justifiable reason now?
The second ground; there must be unanimity of purpose for the members to support their action. On this one, do they have support of majority of their members? The answer is yes and no. Majority of them are united, but not all of them. But that is neither here nor there in a democracy because the national executive has taken a decision, so you are bound by it.
Now, I read that Petroleum and Natural Gas Senior Staff Association of Nigeria (PENGASSAN) and National Union of Petroleum and Natural Gas Workers (NUPENG) said they support the increment. It is a lie. I’ve worked with these people. Are PENGASSAN and NUPENG members not members of the society? Won’t the pinch affect them too? So I did not believe it and I have been proved right.
PENGASSAN has issued a statement that it did not support fuel hike, but supports deregulation. Deregulation and price pump increase are completely different things. When you deregulate, you are saying that a lot of participants will come to the market and price will be determined by market forces. You don’t deregulate and increase price yourself.
Don’t you think the reason given by Vice President Yemi Osinbajo is strong in the sense that we are not earning enough foreign exchange?
I will come to that later. Does Labour have a target? Yes, they have a target. The target is the minister of state for petroleum and the people who increase the price. I will not say government because this is a government decision by implication. There was no time the Federal Executive Council (FEC) sat down and approved this. The head of the government is President Muhammadu Buhari. He was not in the country. Did you take him into confidence? Did you tell him? Let them answer that question. I have an answer.
You think they did not tell him?
If you want to increase the price, why did you rush it? You are increasing price by about 70 per cent and you say with immediate effect. And the President was not in the country. Why do you rush it? Are you afraid that if he comes, he would change it or that he will not support you? There are a lot of questions for the minister of state for petroleum to answer. And a minister of state has no power to do what he did. The permanent secretary in the ministry is even more powerful. Permanent secretary of a ministry is the accounting officer of the ministry. He is also the administrative head of the ministry. The minister is the policy head of the ministry. Minister of state by protocol is not above permanent secretary.
Time will come and I will make formal statements, not just a statement. People are saying that David-West has kept mute and gone into hiding. It’s a lie. A friend of mine whom I respect wrote in Vanguard that I’ve gone into hiding. I’m not in hiding. I’m very much around. I don’t want to make a big and comprehensive statement out of respect for Buhari. I must see him first and itemise the implications of what they have done.
By what they have done, they have embarrassed Buhari. Buhari has always said there is no subsidy. The vice president also was compromised. When they were taking the decision, was the vice president the chairman of the meeting? No. Even Labour (union members) said they were not consulted. They only mentioned it to them.
They brought it like the 10 Commandments, as Christians would say, from Mount Sinai: Here it is; take it. And they pushed it down their throat. It doesn’t work like that in a delicate society like Nigeria. I don’t think people who have done this want Buhari to succeed.
Look at the confusion. Minister of state for petroleum said subsidy removal. The chairman of All Progressives Congress (APC), John Odigie-Oyegun, said subsidy removal. Vice President said it’s not subsidy removal; it’s forex problem. Look at the confusion. Forex problem?
Today (May 17) it’s about N340 to one dollar. By what they have done, they have legalised the black market. They are saying since the Central Bank of Nigeria (CBN) does not have dollars, go to the black market and buy. They call it parallel market. It is not parallel anything; it is black market.
Now, whether black market, white market or normal market, why should the man on the street suffer for your mismanagement of your foreign exchange? All the money Nigeria has abroad, oil makes about 90 per cent. If you have mismanaged your savings abroad, why should the man on the street suffer for it? I wouldn’t have said all these, but for the fact that people are saying I have run away.
I know what to do. I am only respecting Buhari. I respect Kachikwu. I’ve seen his Curriculum Vitae (CV). I respect the CV. But I don’t respect some of the things he says. A man that will say that we have oil in every state in Nigeria is not a serious person. Kachikwu said we have oil deposits in every state in Nigeria. This is scientifically scandalous. It is in fact heresy against science. Heresy against geology.
I don’t regret supporting Buhari. I support him as long as he is on the right track. And if they are trying to deceive him, I will give him my opinion. If he doesn’t take it, I go back to the trench. I agree that the exchange rate is so bad. But all they are doing is not going to solve the problem. They are giving palliatives.
Didn’t Goodluck Jonathan give about 70 palliative? Palliatives are only good on the surface. They don’t address the issues. The fundamental issue is one, is there subsidy? Second question, should there be subsidy? Even Kachikwu himself said subsidy is fraud. Must Nigeria import fuel? Why should exchange rate affect pump price in Nigeria? God has given us oil under our soil. We have marketing outlets above the soil all in naira. Why should exchange factor come in? Why? The refineries are deliberately sabotaged, so that they can import fuel. In all this rigmarole, a quarter of what we have spent on subsidies would have given us 10 to 20 refineries. How much does a refinery cost?
The government says it doesn’t have the money to build refineries.
Must government build refineries? Can’t they make private people build refineries? Allow private people to build it. Give them good atmosphere for business. If you don’t give them good atmosphere, the oil industry will collapse and Nigeria will die. I’ve already said more than what I should. I wouldn’t have said all these, but some people said I have run away. So I have to protect my honour. I have not run away.
Some people are saying that in the last one year there are no signs of change?
That is nonsense. First, they said he did not sign the budget in time. Obasanjo, Jonathan all of them signed budget late. What do they want him to do? I told the president you are not starting from zero. You are starting from minus zero. If Jonathan government had continued for few months, Nigerian government would have been more bankrupt than Greece. You are not coming to renovate a house; you are coming to start from the foundation. It is a different matter if he came and the roof was leaking and the wall was broken. But here, you are not starting renovation. You are building from beginning, and more difficult is that he is starting from minus zero.
I don’t see anything slow in what he is doing. If you say he is slow, it must be slow in reference to something. In this case, in reference to what? Slow is relative terms. You said he did not sign budget in time. It has been proven that three presidents before him signed budget later than himself. They say oh he travels too much. Is it as a jamboree? That is also nonsense. Buhari, if you know him, is an ascetic man. He is not just going round to make money or to enjoy himself. Here is a man that is so frugal with money. Do you know when I was a minister, the pocket allowance was N2,000 a month. You could spend N2,000 without giving account for it. But if you spend more than N2,000, you must give account for it.
He is travelling round! Don’t they see that we need international credibility? What greater credential can Nigeria get? When British Prime Minister, David Cameron, goofed, a whole Archbishop of Canterbury said before the Queen that Buhari is not corrupt. Whether we are fantastically corrupt or whatever corrupt, I don’t know. But we are corrupt. That is true. But what I have against Cameron is that he should have qualified it to say that the present president is doing everything possible to correct it. That is why he invited him to the anti-corruption conference.
In retrospect, I am happy that Cameron never qualified it. If Cameron had said Nigeria is fantastically corrupt, but the present president is trying, it will not be as effective as the Archbishop of Canterbury telling him (Cameron) and the Queen that the current leader is not corrupt. The Archbishop of Canterbury is to Anglicans what Pope is to Catholics.
What about his leadership style and the nature of his appointments? People are saying he is clannish.
Buhari is not clannish in his appointments. I am one of the foremost supporters of Buhari and I wrote two books on him. I’ve written series of articles, interviews. I’ve spent my money on advertisements. A page of advertisement is about N600,000 and I have at least four of them. Have I gotten any money from him? They say he appoints only people that he knows. Am I in his cabinet? Everybody said I would be in the cabinet. In the internet, they said I was number one. Am I complaining? So how can he be clannish? It’s a lie. There are one or two things that I don’t like. I will not say them. But when I see him, I will tell him few areas he has to re-examine and reposition. When I see him, we will discuss one-on-one, alone in the room, nobody with us. In fact, the door will be locked. I will give him my piece of mind, honest assessment and leave him to look at it. But I know that he is still focused. I trust his integrity. I trust his judgement.
Are you comfortable with his handling of the Niger Delta issue and the pro-Biafra agitation?
All I will say is that Niger Delta is for Niger Delta. I have always cautioned that we should be very careful how we handle it. They are embarrassing him. Now they have brought in herdsmen. And he is a Fulani. They are not helping Buhari at all. Why are you making things difficult for him? Why can’t the Northern leaders make things easy for him? I know some of the militants. Asari Dokubo’s mother and my mother are from the same father. Asari Dokubo used to stay with me here at Sankore Avenue. I used to give him ‘pocket money’. I’ve always cautioned that we should be very careful. The companies that are partners with our oil industry, if things are too difficult for them to operate in Nigeria, will go away. Nigeria will suffer and all of us will suffer.
If you are to score Buhari’s government, what mark will you give him so far?
I will give him credit. I will not give him A. I will not give him B. But I will give him C or C plus.
