Lawyer doubts CIA rescued Chibok girls in TV interview to counter misinformation
By Emmanuel Ogebe
“Is CIA saying they asked the Chibok girls to follow them back but they refused to be rescued?” International Human rights lawyer Ogebe knocks US claim it rescued 30 Chibok girls and dares the Nigerian government to publish expenditures on Chibok girls he brought to America in this explosive 10th anniversary interview of the world’s longest running mass abduction.
The lawyer offered to publish his expenditure on the girls in America who the government forcefully took over if they would saying they misspent millions of Nigeria’s scarce resources.
Video https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ozw8MnALLh4
TRANSCRIPT:
CHIBOK GIRLS’ ABDUCTION – REFLECTING ON THE IMPACT AND PROGRESS AFTER A DECADE
LN247 Broadcaster: Ten years have passed since the horrifying abduction of 276 school girls from the government’s girls’ secondary school in Chibok, Northern Nigeria by the terrorist group Boko Haram. This tragic event sparked global outrage and brought attention to the plight of the victims and the broader issue of terrorism in Nigeria.
As this solemn anniversary is marked, it is essential to reflect on the impact of the Chibok abduction and assess the progress made in addressing the underlying issues that led to it.
A speech by [former[ President [Muhammadu] Buhari: We shall redouble efforts to ensure that we fulfill our pledge of bringing the remaining girls back home.
Already, the credible first step has been taken and government will sustain the effort until all the remaining girls return safely. These 21 girls will be given adequate and comprehensive medical, nutritional, and psychological care and support.
LN Broadcaster: The Chibok abduction had profound and far-reaching consequences, both nationally and internationally. It highlighted the vulnerability of school children in conflict zones and exposed the brutality of Boko Haram’s insurgency.
The hashtag “Bring Back Our Girls” campaign galvanized global support for the victims and their families. But despite widespread condemnation, many of the girls remain missing to this day.
Speech by one of bring back our girls members: On one hand, hope has been rekindled, because you saw them, we’ve seen 15 girls, they’re looking well. We don’t know what they’ve gone through, but at least they’re alive and they’re looking well, so we’re happy about that.
Their parents have identified them, and so hope has been rekindled, but at the same time the heartbreak has come again, and unfortunately the parents whose children were not there are devastated.
All the parents in Chibok today, they’re at the school, they’re having a program to mark today and to demand and pressure the government and beg the government to do whatever it can to bring their children back.
LN Broadcaster: The psychological trauma inflicted on the survivors and their communities continues to reverberate. Underscoring the urgent need for comprehensive support and rehabilitation efforts. Despite efforts made by Nigerian Security Forces over the years, the challenge of schools being a soft target for terrorists persists
The latest being the school abduction of more than 200 school children in Kuriga of Kaduna State.
On today’s episode of The Agenda, we wade into the controversies and allegations surrounding the Chibok school mass kidnapping to set the record straight 10 years after with many still in captivity.
Henry Williams (LN News Presenter): Well, thank you for joining us on another edition of the program. And yes, we will be taking a look at the Chibok school abduction, reflecting on the impact and progress after a decade.
My name is Henry Williams. Welcome to The Agenda. And on today’s program, we’re taking a look at some of our talking points on the program.
We’re revolving around the politics behind kidnappings. We also will be looking at impact of abduction on victims. as well as advocacy for victims of kidnapping. Well, there is so much to unpack on today’s edition of the program. As we mark 10 years since the Chibok school kidnapping that took place in April 2014.
Our guest is Emmanuel Ogebe. He’s human rights activist, and he will be joining us from Washington DC in the United States of America.
Well, getting to know who this gentleman Emmanuel Ogebe Esquire is a prominent U.S based international human rights lawyer in Washington, was exiled to America after abduction and torture by late dictator Sani Abacha for protesting the assassination of pro-democracy icon Kudirat Abiola over the Nigerian 1993 election.
Now in Diaspora, advocating on multiple continents, including Europe, North America, Asia, Africa, Australia, and the Middle East. He plays a role in shaping U.S Congressional and foreign policy in Nigeria’s quest for a stable democracy.
His dogged defense of a Nigerian citizen trafficked abroad and sentenced to death pro bono for 15 years led to victory at Indonesia’s Supreme Court, which freed him in December 2023. And with that just in a nutshell of what this gentleman is all about, I’d like to welcome Barrister Emmanuel Ogebe to The Agenda.
Ogebe: Hey, thank you very much Henry. It’s always a pleasure to be with you.
Henry Williams: Great to have you Barrister and such on a fateful day like this, marking 10 years since the kidnap of Chibok school girls took place here in Northern parts of Nigeria and April exactly.
Looking at the situation, there are events that have taken place today in respect of, you know, what happened on that fateful day. Talking about this. let me take us to that event by the Murtala Mohamed Foundation. I do believe you were part of that conversation today.
Ogebe: No, I wasn’t part of any conversation today. As you know I’m in Washington DC and it’s morning right here now. So whatever events you were referring to may have been In Nigeria where it’s evening.
Henry Williams: Alright, let’s quickly take a look at the timeline before we delve into these issues that you are seeking to unravel before us.
You are pained by some narratives that you want to set straight. Let’s look at the timeline of the Chibok School kidnapping in 2014 – 276 Chibok School Girls. With that 57 escaped shortly after the abduction. And then in 2018, Salome Koju, she was rescued on January the 4th.
Moving on, we had 276, okay, still talking about the abduction of the girls. In 2017, Rakiya Gali Abubakar she was released after negotiations on the 6th of May, and in 2016 Amina Ali was released on May 17th, and after negotiations, 21 girls were also released on October the 13th.
Maryam Ali was released on November the 15th. So, I’m trying to take us on a journey here. And so far, we’ve had 185 Chibok [girls returned], and 91 still missing.
Well, can you confirm that Barrister Ogebe?
Ogebe: Let me clarify for you here. Some of what you said was slightly inaccurate. The first girls to escape within 24 to 48 hours of the abductions. Those were 57 girls.
Now, the first girl to escape after that was actually Amina Ali who escaped in May, 2016. So that was two years after the abduction. And then the next girls who were released were actually released by negotiations, prisoner exchange, and ransom.
As I stated, the article, which I released last week, and those were 21 girls.
And then after that Maryam Ali escaped also in 2016. So that is the proper sequence of the first few escapees and those released.
Henry Williams: Oh, okay. Was released in 2016. Maryam Ali Miyanga…. Okay.
Alright. You have given the proper narrative there. Can you confirm in 2022 about 1,2,3,4,5,6 over 10 of those girls were still released?
Ogebe: Well, in 2022. I’m not sure the actual number that emerged in 2022. But again, there was no release. There has been no release. Since 2017, the last release of Chibok Girls was in 2017.
There have been only two releases of Chibok girls in the history of Nigeria. The first release is the one I refer to you now in 2016, 21 Chibok girls were released under a prisoner swap and ransom arrangement where 21 were released, and then the second batch of 82 was released in 2017. That’s it.
In 2022, about two or three girls escaped and were recovered by the Nigerian military. In 2023, again another two or three girls were similarly recovered by the Nigerian military.
Henry Williams: All right. Barrister Ogebe you were part of the hashtag BBOG movement and you have made some assertions, the claim that the United States did not, the American government did not, how do I put it now? free these girls. It was the Nigerian government.
You were very pained by the narrative brought by the book Sisterhood: the Secret History of Women at the CIA by Lisa Mundy. And you really want to set the record straight on the narrative that she brought about, talking about the CIA being instrumental to the release of these girls.
Can you share your thoughts with us on this?
Ogebe: Yeah. So let me be very clear. I’m a human rights lawyer. I have been for over 30 years. You know I have fought military misrule in Nigeria. I have fought military democratic misrule in Nigeria consistently for that entire period of time.
America has been an ally in some of the struggles, to enthrone democracy in Nigeria.
America has been helpful in providing me political asylum when my own country imprisoned and tortured me, you know, so it is very sad for me to see a situation where America is lying about rescuing Chibok girls. Which they did not do.
I was very shocked when a dear friend and colleague, an American law professor, drew my attention to a publication that claimed that the CIA rescued 30 Chibok girls, a book that was released just a few months ago, which you just referenced, the secret history of women in CIA.
And when I read it, it was just full of falsehoods. Nothing like that has happened. And what that tells me is, this is another example of white appropriation. I don’t know what it is about this Chibok story that people are just crawling out of the woodwork, trying to claim what is not theirs.
The fact of the matter is that when it comes to the release of those 103 girls, there are three heroes who were responsible, who were the remote catalysts for the freedom of those 103 girls.
As I said in my article, one was the media and especially CNN. How did that happen?
CNN leaked the proof of life video of the Chibok girls that Boko Haram had given to the Buhari regime and asked them to pay ransom and release prisoners, so that the girls would be released and Buhari refused to watch the video and refused to act on it since 2016, that he didn’t want to be emotionally disturbed. So, he refused to watch it. So, CNN obtained it and released the video to the public.
And when the entire world saw the children begging for their lives for the first time since 2014, it touched a nerve. I was in Abuja at the time and I was with the parents of the children who were shown on the video and the whole world saw it. And so there was an outcry, and pressure was mounted on Buhari to do something about children. That was one factor.
The second factor was the appearance of Amina Ali. After two years in the forest, Amina escaped and came out with her baby. And when her baby was seen and everybody saw that these girls were still alive and one of them was able to come out again, the world was touched. It went around the world.
I remember waking up that morning, my phone rang; a journalist from London called me. Can I confirm that a Chibok girl just came out from captivity? I woke up, I called my contacts in Nigeria. Fortunately, I was in touch with Amina’s family and all of that, and they confirmed to me that it was Amina. So it had a reverberating effect around the world. So that put pressure.
And then thirdly, the global bring back our girls’ campaign in the United States Congress. Myself, the speaker of the house, Nancy Pelosi, Congressman Frederica Wilson, Congresswoman, Sheila Jackson Lee, you know, so many people came together to mount pressure. These were the factors that forced Buhari to take it seriously and bring these girls back.
So for the CIA to now come and claim that they organized an operation and rescued 30 girls is false. It was 21 girls that Buhari paid for their rescue.
Henry Williams: Why do you think the CIA would want to change the narrative,
Ogebe: That is what we’re talking about. Anything that you see, there’s a saying that success has many fathers and failure is an orphan.
Look at some of the efforts we [made], you know, like I took Chibok girls to America and put them in schools. People who didn’t do that, who had no vision, now began to compete against me. [They] went and carried the girls out to one… and claim credit for what they didn’t do. This is the kind of world in which we are.
Henry Williams: Barrister, let’s talk about that aspect. There is another side, some people are alluding to [the fact] that the hashtag BBOG was somewhat of a cash cow for some NGOs to actually make money from international donors. What’s your position on that?
Ogebe: I don’t know how it was a cash cow to make money for international donors. Because what I can tell you is this, the international community contributed millions of dollars to Nigeria to make schools safe. And from that time till now, schools have not been made safe in Nigeria.
I can tell you that I sponsored Chibok girls to the United States who are not being taken care of by the Nigerian government and guess what? Up till now, as I’m speaking to you, those that the Nigerian government took over, if you hear how much they have spent on them, millions, you cannot see a commensurate graduation and qualification compared to those who millions were not spent on.
Henry Williams: That’s really sad because in your reports, you also cited that the rights groups and stakeholders are criticized by the Nigerian government for the treatment of the freed girls were held in Abuja were not allowed to see their parents as well. Can you share more about that?
Ogebe: You see, it’s a very sad situation. You see when Amina Ali came out, back from captivity, she was held incomunicado in the [Presidential] Villa and in other locations for a long time. And it was so bad, they were bringing a malam to come and instruct her in religious studies.
And at a point she had to protest and say, “I was a Christian when I was abducted, I have escaped, Why are you forcing me? and bringing me an instructor in Islam. I’m supposed to be free now. Let me go back to my religion”. So that was a problem.
The government was trying to force her into the religion that the terrorists had forced her into. Then, you know, of course the issue of releasing her to her family, they did not do that.
As you saw in the article. Now, when the other 21 girls came back, the same thing, they kept them in Abuja for a long time, didn’t allow them to go to their village. In fact, one of the girls who came back attempted suicide while in the custody of the Nigerian government. Attempted suicide.
So, the question arose, why would a girl who was in the forest with Boko and didn’t attempt suicide now is free and is in Abuja now wants to commit suicide under the Nigerian government? That tells you that conditions under the Nigerian government were worse than conditions under Boko Haram in the forest.
Now, let me even go a step further. One of the Chibok girls who was taken from my sponsorship here in the U.S, she was living in a $2 million house here in America.
Yeah. The Nigerian government took her and put her in an apartment in the Bronx Ghetto in New York. Sometime later, I heard that she attempted suicide. So anything that the Nigerian government involves itself in, is bad for whoever is under it. If you look at the Nigerian country now, it is bad for whoever is under it. That is why people are fleeing. And that is exactly what happened to them.
Henry Williams: Very serious allegations Barrister Ogebe. Did you bring these things up before now? And exactly can you, based on your submissions, could we allude to the sense that these girls, the way they were treated, and the seemingly nonchalant approach to the kidnap was because they were not Muslims?
Ogebe: The facts of the matter are very clear, Chibok is the most Christian local government in the whole of Borno state.
Henry Williams: And we can’t hear you clearly. Your audio seems to be muffled.
Ogebe: I said Chibok is the most Christian local government in the whole of Borno state and so 90 per cent of the girls that were abducted were Christians. Over 276 girls were taken away and as we speak, over 90 of those girls are still not back till today, 10 years later.
All right, let us look at Dabchi. Dabchi was [where] predominantly Muslim girls were taken. Only one was Christian. After one month, all the girls came back, only one girl didn’t come back and the only one girl that didn’t come back was Leah, the Christian. How can you say that it is not a factor of religion?
Henry Williams: That’s really sad Barrister Ogebe, now looking at all these allegations right now. What can we learn from what has happened in 2014? Do you think government has taken steps?
You talked about the issue of the Safe School Initiative, which was actually brought up by Gordon Brown, if I’m correct, spearheaded by him through the U.N to ensure that these schools are safer, children can go to school. Do you think government has actually responded to the insecurity concerning the schools?
Ogebe: Well, from my recollection, a minimum of about $44 million was contributed by, I believe it was Japan, Canada, and several countries. $44 million was contributed for safe schools’ initiative.
As at one to two years ago, it was reported that Nigerian schools are still less than 50 percent safe. So it is clear. And when it comes to mass school abductions, Nigeria is still the school mass abductions’ capital of the world.
Last month, in the first week of March, over 200 school students were abducted from one school in one day. Since Chibok, there have been nothing less than half a dozen mass school abductions, equivalent to what happened in Chibok. So, the situation in Nigeria has deteriorated. It hasn’t improved.
So there’s nothing to be happy or proud about whether we have learned any lessons.
Henry Williams: Are you aware of the status of Chibok right now, especially the schools? Because when this incident happened, the schools were burnt down. And total facility was destroyed. Are you aware if government has replaced those structures, if those facilities have been replaced?
Ogebe: Well, there was a lot of controversy because the federal government gave the Nigerian army, I believe it was the call engineers or so. I Don’t know if it was N2.5 billion to rebuild the school and they were supposed to rebuild the school and then there was a tug of war because Borno State wanted to rebuild the school.
You see, at a point it became over who will get the contract, who will do this, who will do that. There was a lot of infighting and which delayed it for years. But my understanding is that it has now been rebuilt.
But I don’t know the condition and status of the school. I can tell you that we were on a fact-finding mission to Dapchi, Leah’s school on the sixth anniversary of her abduction in February. And the school is abandoned. Leah’s school is abandoned and animals have taken over. There are no classes going on nothing.
Henry Williams: Okay. Let’s take some sound bites from five years. You know, after the kidnap from activists who took to the streets to protest for the return of these girls, let’s hear their words and find out if anything has changed since then.
A from Chibok parents for lack of education
Parent 1: All we need is for our children, our people, to continue to further their education. But for now, two years, no school, no learning, no work.
Parent 2: We have been begging government to open even a secondary school, government secondary school for boys. Up to now, nothing. Only this female school. And the female school now, where is it?
And really Boko Haram has achieved their aim. They’re saying that they don’t want the Western education.
Parent 3: You know, we are redundant. We are abandoned by the government, in fact. We are very sorry to mention. Because since this thing happens, we have a lot of children living at home without doing anything. And we are very, we are poor enough. No road, no market, no water supply, no electricity.
Parent 4: When I see my daughter coming back to me, I will feel such joy. Joy in my heart. All the sickness and other things will disappear and I will be very happy in my life.
Parent 5: It is exactly five years today. We know Nigerian government has tried, soldier too, they have tried. But up to now, we are still looking for 112 girls in the hands of captors, [about] which we as parents, we want God’s intervention.
Henry Williams: All right. And that brings back some memories. Parents at that time, you know, asking government to bring back their girls, bring back their children. And right now, it’s only about, about 90, over 90 are still in captivity. Barrister Ogebe, do you think the parents have given up on these children?
Apparently, it looks like a lost cause. Who do they turn to? How do they get redress in all of this? It seems they’ve been forgotten and left behind.
Ogebe: You know, it’s a very sad situation indeed. I never forget, you know, one of the Chibok girls, one of the 10 Chibok girls I brought to America. She phoned me from school one day and she said, uncle, my auntie called me and she said, is there anybody who is still talking about our missing daughters in America?
And I told her, I said that uncle Emmanuel is the only one who is still talking. And she said, tell him to please remember to talk about my daughter. And so I asked her to give me the auntie’s number and I have been in touch with the auntie, you know, and you know, I tried to continue to speak up.
But sadly, sadly, the sad thing is that in Nigeria, people don’t understand how to separate human rights from politics. You don’t know how to separate wrong from rights.
Any human being born of a woman should understand the importance of trying to recover a child for his parents. It’s not an APC issue. It’s not a PDP issue. It is a humanity issue. It is a kingdom issue. So long as you were created in the image of God, you should see divinity in trying to restore a child to his parents.
How the Buhari administration decided that this was a basis for attacking people who spoke out that they should help bring the children back is another issue altogether. True. The Jonathan administration felt that it [our campaign to free the Chibok girls] was an attack on the administration. But they did not attack with violence.
What they did was, you know, with propaganda, they shared money to lobbyists. They paid lobbyists in America a million dollars to fight us. But when Buhari regime came in, they came in with military intelligence, military operations, NSA [National Security Adviser]. They were fighting us with death, real death.
I had to sue them to court. They wanted to, they said they would revoke my Nigerian passport. The Nigerian ambassador in Washington wrote a memo to revoke my Nigerian passport. I had to report them to the U.S government because it was a crime.
So, that was how bad it was. And so, we were the ones who were giving hope to the parents because we kept speaking and encouraging them. But the fights became too much and some of them succumbed. A lot of them died. From my understanding, over 25 parents died.
One of the girls who came back last year, she came back two weeks after her father died. So, her father did not leave to see the return of his daughter two weeks later.
But I will tell you this, the mere fact that three girls came back nine years after tells you that there is hope that even where the government failed to rescue them, the girls are rescuing themselves.
I must say we have to give some credit to the Nigerian military because it is their operations that are creating the enabling environment. To help these girls come out.
One of my happiest days was recently when I was in Nigeria, I think it was last year. I was watching TV and I saw the first lady Remi Tinubu on TV hugging a Chibok girl who had just escaped. You know, it really touched me because it wasn’t over politicized like the Buhari era, you know? She hugged her, welcomed her, and spoke kindly to her.
You know, so I think that there is hope that with the proper, you know military action and the girls continuing to escape by themselves that we will get more and more of the girls back.
But let me be clear, as I said in my article, just released yesterday, part two of my article 10 reasons why the U.S did not rescue the Chibok girls.
Henry Williams: We’ll take a quick break. When we come back, we want you to give us those 10 reasons. And before we begin to talk about the impact on the victims, and as you have given some light of hope that it’s possible that these girls can still return, we’d like to see how possible that is.
Stay with us.
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Henry Williams: Great to have you back. You’re still watching The Agenda. And yeah, we’ve been reflecting on the moments, the emotions surrounding the Chibok school kidnap 10 years after today, when 276 girls of Chibok School were taken away. Until date, about 91 are still in captivity.
My guest, Emmanuel Ogebe, a human rights lawyer, yeah, he’s been a very, very much involved in seeing to the return of these girls. Right from the moment these things happened, he’s been in the thick of things and shares with us and clarifying some of the narratives, you know giving us the right record of what actually happened.
Well, Barrister, thank you for sharing more insights on this. And you, especially, were pained when the U.S the book Sisterhood was giving the wrong narrative. And you have ten reasons to actually assert that account was totally wrong. Can you quickly share those ten reasons that you have to share with us, before we move into other things?
Ogebe: Well, you know, there are so many of them you know, I don’t know that I can go into all of them offhand.
But you know, let me start with the one that pained me the most, which was you know, why don’t you, if you have it in front of you, number 10, if you don’t mind reading it. Since I don’t have it in front of me.
Henry Williams: I actually don’t have it here, but I know I thought you would have it being the writer.
Ogebe: Alright, yeah, let me just say briefly so reason number 10 was the book claims that according to the CIA they wanted to recover all of the girls, but according to them some of the girls didn’t want to come back because they didn’t want to leave their babies behind.
And so they just brought, you know, 30 of them. And then they brought one or two of them in trickles later.
And so, what I am saying is the CIA trying to tell us that they went to Sambisa Forest, they captured, or they gathered all the Chibok girls and they saw, yeah, we are here to carry people back home.
And so they say, ah! no ooo. I can’t leave my baby behind ooo… So…
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